Can We Be Happy Here? - Fiona
Subject: Can We Be Happy Here? - Fiona
Date: Tue, 03 Jun 1995 05:55 GMT
>email@example.com (Madhudvisa dasa ) wrote:
>> This world is designed to be frustrating. Nothing will ever be perfect
>> here. If it were we would have no impetus to go to the spiritual world.
>> You will never be able to solve all the problems.
>> mam upetya punar janma duhkhalayam asasvatam
>> napnuvanti mahatmanah samsiddhim paramam gatah
>>"After attaining Me, the great souls, who are yogis in devotion, never
>>return to this material world, which is full of miseries, because they
>>have attained the highest perfection."
>Hmm, I cannot see the point in escaping to a 'spiritual world'.
Yes.. That is maya. We think we can stay here and be happy but we can't. We are
all forced to leave like it or not... That is the problem. You may make some
fairy-tale dream world here but you can't "live happily ever after." You have to
get old, you have to get sick and then you have to die... A transcendentalist
knows it is not him that is geting old and dying, it is the body. We are not the
body, we are the spirit-soul within. Thinking we are the body is the beginning of
all our problems. And thinking we can be happy by making the body comfortable is
>That is assuming
>this spiritual world you speak of is outside Earth / outside of the self...
>is something I have been tackling for a while. Often there is a will to escape
>from this world but that is not the way.. the idea is to bring all that
>wonderful divine perfection onto earth and it IS possible.
How? You have to get old and die... That is far from perfect!
>You know I think
>sometimes we think too much, tends to complicate things. Jesus said follow his
>example, literally become like Christ, devoted to the Earths spiritual
>progression, in unity with all and merging in totality.
Did Christ say this? "In unity with all and merging in totality..." I'm sure he
didn't! That comes from India and it is the trademark of the Mayavadis. They don't
accept a personal God, they talk of Brahman... But Jesus clearly speaks of his
Father, a person, in the kingdom of God...
>I know these words may
>seem cliched but
They certainly do! "It's all one." "There is no you, there is no me, there is no
God.. it's all one!" Can I ask you one question, if it is actually all one and I
am you and you are me how is it I am independent from you? Why don't I know what
you are thinking. Why don't you know what I am thinking?
>try to feel the meaning. It is what you already know... always
NONSENSE. We know something completely different. We know people, we know
relationships, we know love. But if it is "all one" these are all illusions. There
are no people, there are no relationships and there if no love... Because
individuality is an illusion. But that is horrible! We get pleasure from
interacting with other people, from relationships. But you are saying this is all
false. There are many problems with our relationships here, in the material world,
but that is because they are perverted reflections of our original relationship
with God in the spiritual world. Real pleasure is there in reestablishing our
original relationship with God and going back home, back to Godhead.
>though when I get high on life I try to bring it into my body so it is with
>This highest perfection thing - what is that? Something is even perfect or not
That is God, Krishna.
>perfect , how can you have ahigher perfection than perfect? (mind stuff?). The
>reason I ask is because you can view things from different places of your
>see different truths or nontruths in every situation. Maybe everything is
NO. God is absolute. You may see Him from different perspectives, that is true.
But He is absolutely perfect.
>already perfect and we just chose not to experience that perfection? It is
How is geting old and dying perfect? Of course if you are spiritually advanced
you know you are not the body and then you know that "you" are eternal... Then one
can see things as perfect... But not like you have said in your posting, making
this material world perfect. It's not meant for perfection -- that's what the
spiritual world is for. This place is to allow us to exercise our desires to enjoy
separately from God but it is designed to frustrate us...
>I used to think there were different types of love when really love is love!
>it is always there... always even when i don't 'see' it.
Yes. Real love is love for God. If you love God you will see Him in everyone's
heart so naturally you will develop love for everyone.
>Well, that is all for now. Enjoy your day!
Thank You. Hare Krishna!
Thank you. Hare Krishna!
All glories to His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada!